Obama camp re-names DNC "Animal Farm"

Preface:  This diary is in response to all those who call people who used to support Hillary Clinton, and are now going to vote for Barack Obama, "deadenders", simply because we refuse to rewrite history, we remember how this race unfolded, and we're not happy about it.

A few weeks ago, I took my son to the library, and while my wife was watching him, I looked for a couple books that might draw my interest this summer.  I ended up picking out George Orwell's Animal, among others.  Don't get me wrong, I had read Animal Farm before.  However, I believe that was in high school when I read Animal Farm, and I'm now in my mid-to-late 30's.  So, I figured I'd revisit a classic.

Well, after reading it again, and participating on MyDD since Hillary Clinton suspended her campaign and endorsed Obama, I've noticed certain similarities between what happened in the book, and what has happened to the Democratic party.  

Orwell's Animal Farm is described as follows:

Old Major, a prize-winning boar, gathers the animals of the Manor Farm for a meeting in the big barn. He tells them of a dream he has had in which all animals live together with no human beings to oppress or control them. He tells the animals that they must work toward such a paradise and teaches them a song called "Beasts of England," in which his dream vision is lyrically described. The animals greet Major's vision with great enthusiasm. When he dies only three nights after the meeting, three younger pigs--Snowball, Napoleon, and Squealer--formulate his main principles into a philosophy called Animalism.

Late one night, the animals manage to defeat the farmer Mr. Jones in a battle, running him off the land. They rename the property Animal Farm and dedicate themselves to achieving Major's dream. The cart-horse Boxer devotes himself to the cause with particular zeal, committing his great strength to the prosperity of the farm and adopting as a personal maxim the affirmation "I will work harder."

At first, Animal Farm prospers....  When Mr. Jones reappears to take back his farm, the animals defeat him again, in what comes to be known as the Battle of the Cowshed, and take the farmer's abandoned gun as a token of their victory. As time passes, however, Napoleon and Snowball increasingly quibble over the future of the farm, and they begin to struggle with each other for power and influence among the other animals. Snowball concocts a scheme to build an electricity-generating windmill, but Napoleon solidly opposes the plan. At the meeting to vote on whether to take up the project, Snowball gives a passionate speech. Although Napoleon gives only a brief retort, he then makes a strange noise, and nine attack dogs--the puppies that Napoleon had confiscated in order to "educate"--burst into the barn and chase Snowball from the farm. Napoleon assumes leadership of Animal Farm and declares that there will be no more meetings. From that point on, he asserts, the pigs alone will make all of the decisions--for the good of every animal.

Napoleon now quickly changes his mind about the windmill, and the animals, especially Boxer, devote their efforts to completing it. One day, after a storm, the animals find the windmill toppled. The human farmers in the area declare smugly that the animals made the walls too thin, but Napoleon claims that Snowball returned to the farm to sabotage the windmill.

He stages a great purge, during which various animals who have allegedly participated in Snowball's great conspiracy--meaning any animal who opposes Napoleon's uncontested leadership--meet instant death at the teeth of the attack dogs. With his leadership unquestioned (Boxer has taken up a second maxim, "Napoleon is always right"), Napoleon begins expanding his powers, rewriting history to make Snowball a villain.

Napoleon also begins to act more and more like a human being--sleeping in a bed, drinking whisky, and engaging in trade with neighboring farmers. The original Animalist principles strictly forbade such activities, but Squealer, Napoleon's propagandist, justifies every action to the other animals, convincing them that Napoleon is a great leader and is making things better for everyone--despite the fact that the common animals are cold, hungry, and overworked....

Years pass on Animal Farm, and the pigs become more and more like human beings--walking upright, carrying whips, and wearing clothes. Eventually, the seven principles of Animalism, known as the Seven Commandments and inscribed on the side of the barn, become reduced to a single principle reading "all animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others." Napoleon entertains a human farmer named Mr. Pilkington at a dinner and declares his intent to ally himself with the human farmers against the laboring classes of both the human and animal communities. He also changes the name of Animal Farm back to the Manor Farm, claiming that this title is the "correct" one. Looking in at the party of elites through the farmhouse window, the common animals can no longer tell which are the pigs and which are the human beings.

http://www.sparknotes.com/lit/animalfarm /summary.html

Well, there are those of us who look at the 2008 Democratic primary process, and see it as nothing more than a group of younger Democrats, upset at how rich and fat their superiors have become, conspiring together to overthrow their leaders and take over the party "for the people", demonizing the old guard, and purging the party of anyone who does not agree to demonize the old guard, as well.  

How do we see it that way?  Well, for starters, many prominent Obama supporters have made their intentions quite clear.  

Take for example Donna Brazile:

BRAZILE:  Well, Lou, I have worked on a lot of Democratic campaigns, and I respect Paul. But, Paul, you're looking at the old coalition.  A new Democratic coalition is younger.  It is more urban, as well as suburban, and we don't have to just rely on white blue-collar voters and Hispanics. We need to look at the Democratic Party, expand the party, expand the base and not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Or this, from Obama himself:

Obama clearly felt that the Clintons had already exhausted their possibilities as leaders. They "have been the dominant political force in the Democratic Party for 20 years," he said. "A sizable number of prominent Democrats in Washington, the sort of government-in-waiting, all came in with the Clintons. There's enormous loyalty there, as there should be. What's interesting is that they all came in as outsiders; most of them came in as outsiders running against Washington. They're now Washington, and I don't think there's any denying that Washington established a set of rules that people get comfortable with about how you play the game."

Or this:

"The one thing I am absolutely certain of," Obama told me, "is that if all I'm offering is the same Democratic narrative that has been offered for the last 20 years, then there's really no point in my running, because Senator Clinton is going to be very adept at delivering that message. What makes it worthwhile for me to run is the belief that we can actually change the narrative and create a working majority that we haven't seen in a very long time--and that, frankly, the Clintons never put together."

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200712/cl inton-obama

One blogger even put together a solid timeline establishing that the DNC has been supporting Obama over Clinton SINCE JANUARY, 2008, BEFORE SUPER TUESDAY (a few snippets):

Who has Harmed the Democratic Party?

Children do it often.  When they get caught misbehaving, they tend to point fingers in every direction except toward the mirror.  When adults engage in such behavior, it inspires questions about their rationality and character.

As adults, we can all agree that any negative statement by any Democratic candidate against another Dem candidate during a primary could undermine the party's ultimate efforts to establish unity before a general election.

That said, the DNC (and many media) seem to blame Hillary Clinton's campaign as the one that advanced all the divisiveness.  She certainly has said some negative things about Barack Obama.  I admit it, and the media has been all over it for months, so I need not provide examples here.

Hillary is not the only one whose words (or actions) might have caused party division.  Obama said and implied very negative things about his fellow Democrat, Hillary. Yet, the DNC (and many media) never really called Obama out.  

The most recent example was on Friday, when the Obama campaign bizarrely made an issue of  Hillary's reference to Robert F. Kennedy. Preferring to start with less recent examples, I'll get into the RFK non-issue later.

Starting in January, Obama supporters falsely called Hillary a racist after she acknowledged that Martin Luther King had needed a president's help to turn his dreams into laws. Obama supporter James Clyburn lobbed implied racism accusations twice -- just before the primaries in two heavily African American states (North Carolina and South Carolina).

That was downright harmful to the cause of party unity, but the DNC didn't chastise Obama's campaign. And Obama didn't timely chastise his surrogates or supporters....

Disseminating common-enemy talking points is a way to split a party, not unify it.  Obama likely knew this and did it anyway.  The DNC remained silent....

I could go on with examples, but my point is this: Hillary's not alone in deserving blame, because Obama has contributed a good-sized share of the negativity and divisiveness that may ultimately hinder efforts to unify the party.

Moreover, the candidates aren't the only ones who contributed to the party's division. The DNC's own leaders chose to act in ways that have infuriated many Dem voters....

Those actions gave many Dems the impression that the DNC wanted Obama to win at any cost -- even if 2 sates' Dem voters were disregarded.  That the DNC has remained silent while Obama's campaign used divisive tactics only intensified that impression.

Naturally, many Hillary-supporting Dems feel that the DNC does not care about what they think or want.

This top-down, disregard-the-little-guy style of leadership has caused many ordinary Dems to notice similarities between the DNC and the GOP. That's a major deal breaker.

In short, the DNC's own leadership countered its own purported goal of party unity by repeatedly alienating so many of its members....

http://bucknakedpolitics.typepad.com/buc k_naked_politics/2008/05/hillarys-rfk-re .html

In Animal Farm, the pigs that purged the farm of the humans wrote a list of commandments, as follows:

1.  Whatever goes upon two legs is an enemy.

  1.  Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
  2.  No animal shall wear clothes.
  3.  No animal shall sleep in a bed.
  4.  No animal shall drink alcohol.
  5.  No animal shall kill any other animal.
  6.  All animals are equal.

However, as the pigs grew more and more accustomed to being the leaders of the farm, they became more and more like the humans they had purged.  For example, they began drinking alcohol.  The other animals seemed to remember that one of the commandments was "No animal shall drink alcohol", and were confused and upset.  So, they went to where the Seven Commandments were written, and it now said "No animal shall drink alcohol to excess".  The animals scratched the perverbial heads, and wondered why they didn't remember the last two words "to excess".  

In other words, the pigs had to re-write history, and convince all of their subjects that the Commandment regarding alcohol always had the words "to excess" in it.  And those who questioned whether history was being re-written were considered traitors to the cause.  

The theme was similar to another George Orwell book, 1984, in which the history books were always being changed to fit the political narrative, because it was assumed by those in power that the people would not follow them if they knew the entire truth ("we have never been at war with East Asia.  We have always been at war with East Africa" (or whatever it was).

This is what some Obama supporters on MyDD have become.  They insist that you not only agree to vote for Obama, but that you re-write history and accept as reality that his victory was 100% pure, and untainted by media bias, propaganda, slash and burn character assasination, or a conspiracy to purge the DNC of the old (Clinton) guard, and if you don't, they'll tear your perverbial throat out.  

It is not enough that they are in control.  It is not enough if you follow them.  It is not enough if you support them.  You have to actually go through a brainwashing/re-training, until all concerns regarding the manner in which Obama won with the assistance of the DNC and the media are replaced with slogans and songs in favor of not only the dear leader, but each and every person who made it possible, such as Keith Olbermann, and Howard Dean.  

In Animal Farm, the slogan was "four legs good, two legs bad", until the pigs learned to walk on two legs, and changed the slogan to "four legs good, two legs better".

I can't wait to see how some Obama supporters are going to change the slogan "yes we can" into "oh, no you didn't!", once they are firmly in control of the DNC and getting fat, lazy, and more and more like those they purged from the party.  Regardless, I refuse to be brainwashed in the Orwellian fashion propounded by many MyDD Obama supporters.  

I'll vote for Obama, but I'll never forget that Hillary Clinton most likely would have won on a level playing field - - - NEVER.  

As I have read Animal Farm, I know what that means.  Soon, the pigs will send the dogs to tear my throat out, while the sheep keep bleating "four legs good, two legs better", in the background.



Display:


Tips for my re-education camp ticket? (2.00 / 3)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:02:37 PM EST

Yeah...coming right up... (2.00 / 5)


should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?
by Firewall on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:34:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

LLamas suck.An alpaca would tear its throat out.nt (2.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:37:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Tips for my re-education camp ticket? (2.00 / 11)

Yes.

Barack Obama is just like a Soviet dictator. He's going to force people, at gunpoint, to accept a new version of history, and burn all records to the contrary. He's -

::head explodes from combination of insanity and stupidity::


The primaries are over!
Focus on McCain
by really not a troll on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:39:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yes, b/c any comparison that is not 100% accurate (2.00 / 1)

is a shitty analogy.

In other words, there are no such things as analogies, there are only identical situations.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:43:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Analogy (2.00 / 0)

Apparently, some people are unfamiliar with the concept of "analogy", and even less familiar with the concept of literature as "social commentary".


by LakersFan on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 03:42:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Tips for my re-education camp ticket? (2.00 / 2)

My Goodness... you finally did it!  YOU MANIACS!!! YOU BLEW HIS HEAD UP!!!  DARN YOU!!! DARN YOU ALL TO HECK!!!!  ;-)


It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)
by LordMike on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:17:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Look...It's Animial Farm (none / 0)

Heh...Look at all the recomendations for a silly comment.


by soyousay on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 03:07:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama camp re-names (2.00 / 6)

Oh lord.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:04:51 PM EST

alright (2.00 / 1)

Snark?

Good call on the SparkNotes, though. Animal Farm is hard reading, some real cryptic metaphors in there.

Personally, I think this primary was a lot more like Swann's Way with Chris Dodd in the role of Marcel.


by Stroszek on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:06:32 PM EST

Re: Obama camp (2.00 / 1)

Dean would have won, too, if the stupid media hadn't kept playing the "scream" over and over. If I had the time (and interest) I bet I could work up a comparison to Animal Farm also.


by Becky G on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:06:45 PM EST

I'd be interested to see it. And I agree about (2.00 / 1)

Dean.  That's why Obama supporters who used to be Dean supporters should stop trying to re-write history, and just accept that their current candidate won for the same reasons their former candidate lost.  Otherwise, they look like hypocrites, no?


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:08:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd be interested to see it. And I agree abou (2.00 / 3)

No, because it's only a fringe of Neo-LaRouchies who buy into your "history."


by Stroszek on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:14:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Should I call you Becky from now on, Stroszek? nt (2.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:38:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Surely (2.00 / 1)

You can't be serious!!!


by BlueinColorado on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:45:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd be interested to see it. And I agree abou (2.00 / 2)

All I was trying to say was that this diarist sounds like a person who is just obsessing too much about the primary loss (from his/her point of view). I could do that too about Dean but I moved on pretty quickly and supported Kerry. I don't understand all these diaries about all the negatives associated with the Dem candidate's winning. There are ALWAYS things the losing side can be legitimately upset about. Fine. It's done.


by Becky G on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:13:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Wow (2.00 / 12)

"As I have read Animal Farm, I know what that means.  Soon, the pigs will send the dogs to tear my throat out, while the sheep keep bleating "four legs good, two legs better", in the background."

Get over yourself.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:08:34 PM EST

Why, I thought that was one of the best parts of (2.00 / 1)

the diary. :(


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:09:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why, I thought that was one (2.00 / 5)

You're implying that somebody is going to kill you for a lack of sufficient political orthodoxy, right?

Even as humor, that's a pretty shit bit of prose.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:10:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I guess I'll keep my day job, huh? You try writing (2.00 / 1)

a diary whilst at work, and see if you can do better.  But remember, there are some who come here hoping to be discovered as authors, journalists, politicians, or advocates, and some who come here just to have conversations.  Given that I'm not looking to be discovered, and I only have so much time in which to author a diary, I think my diary was pretty damn good.  Yay, me!!!


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:20:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I guess I'll keep my day job, huh? (1.85 / 7)

No one's expecting you to write the next great American Novel as a diary entry.

Which is not to say that people aren't going to slam you - repeatedly - for writing melodramatic nonsense.


The primaries are over!
Focus on McCain
by really not a troll on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:46:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I guess I'll keep my day job, huh? You try wri (2.00 / 2)

Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise: and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding. (Proverbs 17:28)


by username on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:27:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why, I thought that was one (2.00 / 5)

Since DNC behaviour is nowadays compared to Zimbabwe by the deadenders he can certainly expect imprisonent, torture, death, etc, from the Obama camp, as happens by the Mugabe squads in Zimbabwe against his opponents.


by Aris Katsaris on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:21:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Don't forget:Olbermann is the DJ from Hotel Rwanda (2.00 / 1)

except that Olbermann's a bit more unhinged than that guy who talked about cutting down the "tall trees".  


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:39:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama camp (2.00 / 1)

Who do you want as president? McCain or Obama? Those are your options.

Over 4100 Americans have been killed in Iraq. How many more will die, be maimed, and will suffer traumatic brain injury by the end of a McCain presidency?


We care about politics because we know politics matters for people's lives and opportunities.
by politicsmatters on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:10:14 PM EST

Was that for me? You didn't read the diary huh?nt (2.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:21:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama camp (2.00 / 1)

He says in the first line he is voting for the Nominee... he also has a very biased view on how the race unfolded (which in truth so do I although I would bet more people agree with me than PJ on how it unfolded).  Its a good diary, just opinioned based while seeming to claim its fact base... that's my only issue.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:45:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Does an even playing field (2.00 / 9)

include a 100-delegate head start?


by JJE on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:11:25 PM EST

on that count... (2.00 / 3)

it's funny that DNC officials were the LAST source of delegates to come on board with Obama over Clinton, at the very end of the process when the outcome was not in doubt. For much of the campaign, the closeness of the race depended on party stalwarts bolstering Clinton against the relative weakness of her electoral results.


by Casuist on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:20:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

DNC officials were the last to (2.00 / 2)

officially endorse Obama, because it would look AWEFUL for them to do so earlier.  Their endorsements were a mere formality.  Their comments to the media from January until the primaries ended, well not so much.  They were in the tank for Obama and did whatever they could behind the scenes to help him, until the primaries were over.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:24:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So they were for her before (2.00 / 8)

they were against her?

If you're going to go with the "The party stole the nomination from poor Hillary" you're going to have to explain why that same party gave her that 100 delegate head start.


by JJE on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:38:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

so... (2.00 / 2)

because they were in the tank for Obama... they delayed committing until the very end of the campaign allowing Clinton to maintain a superdelegate lead and make the race seem closer than it was... for the sake of appearances.

That rationalization doesn't even pass basic tests of logical consistency. Moreover, your suggestion that they made their influence known by way of disproportionate media support has no standing whatsoever. Relatively few DNC officials made any sort of media impact in the race at all. Elected officials make more news... and Clinton had more of those as well for quite some time.

You give me a Brazile. I raise you an Ickes... your victimization story is conspiracy theory-grade absurd.


by Casuist on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:52:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

ummm.... (2.00 / 6)


Well, Lou, I have worked on a lot of Democratic campaigns, and I respect Paul. But, Paul, you're looking at the old coalition.  A new Democratic coalition is younger.  It is more urban, as well as suburban, and we don't have to just rely on white blue-collar voters and Hispanics. We need to look at the Democratic Party, expand the party, expand the base and not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Um... isn't expanding the party a good thing?


by Casuist on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:14:52 PM EST

Silly you (2.00 / 3)

You have to cut the "just" out of Brazile's comment, to make it look like she wants to exclude white blue-collar voters and Hispanics.

You can't be a victim if you acknowledge the rhetoric of inclusion.


by BlueinColorado on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:48:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: ummm.... (2.00 / 2)

I've never understood the outcry over this comment.  Unless you wilfully misconstrue it to mean leaving out blue-collar voters and Hispanics, I don't see how the new coalition Brazile argues for can be a bad thing.  It's adding to what's already there!  It's expaning the base! Seems like a no-brainer to me.

Unfortunately, enough pro-Clinton voices distorted the meaning of this phrase to imply some sort of AA-intelligentsia takeover of the party--by cutting out other groups--that PJ can merely cite the quote itself without having to explain him/herself.  That distorted meaning plays nicely with the threats by actual deadenders to walk out.

And PJ, I note and applaud your decision to vote for the Democrat this fall.   I'm not sure what the point of this diary is, though.  You give a storyline of the primary process, one that points to the kind of "Obama just pulled off a coup-->weak analogy-->Hitler, Stalin, Napoleon, Big Brother, scary bad man authoritarian.  Are you warning people that many Clintonites feel this way, and Obama ignores it to his own peril?  All right, fine, I feel ya.  It's clearly to his interest to build bridges and fix the party.  You don't like how he's doing it?  Okay, let's hope he does a better job.  

But I don't think you're convincing anybody that this fascistic/corrupt/conspiracist story you're pushing--where every up and down in the primary process is fully explainable to everybody plotting against you--has anything to do with reality.


What is The October Protocol?
by Koan on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:40:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Entitled much? (2.00 / 10)

a group of younger Democrats, upset at how rich and fat their superiors have become

Emphasis added.


John McCain
by Mandoliniment on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:15:49 PM EST

Superiors as in employers/bosses, not better nt (2.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:24:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The main problem with your phrase (1.85 / 7)

"Hillary Clinton most likely would have won on a level playing field"

The main problem with this phrase isn't your guesswork about alternate realities -- though it's one problem indeed.

The problem with this phrase is your belief that this particular alternate reality (a level playing field) can exist at all.

What's a level playing field?
If Clinton wasn't a woman and Obama wasn't a man, but both were hermaphrodites.
If Clinton wasn't white and Obama wasn't black, but both were green.
If Hillary hadn't been married to Bill, and if Barack hadn't been in Wright's church.
If Hillary wasn't older, and Barack wasn't younger, but both were the exact same age.
If both had been born in the exact same state, had the same religion, supported the same baseball team.

If you could do all that, then you might be able to have a level-playing field between the two of them.

But since that's not possible, it means we can't have level playing fields. What we can do is write the rules so as to make the playing field as fair as possible, and then accept the winner among those who played by these rules.


by Aris Katsaris on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:18:45 PM EST

1. Impartial media; 2. Impartial DNC. A start. n (2.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:25:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: 1. Impartial media; 2. Impartial DNC. A star (2.00 / 4)

You are right, it was amazing how Obama overcame the media that said Clinton was inevitable and made up BS attacks on him based on wright or "bittergate" and the party bigwigs that gave his opponent a 100 delegate lead before anyone had even voted.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:43:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: 1. Impartial media; 2. Impartial DN (2.00 / 4)

If the DNC was impartial the race would have been over by the end of February. Their combination of Clinton-endorsement-advantage and willingness to reconsider the rules they had laid down the previous year is what kept Clinton -
...
...
you know what? I'm done arguing about this. There's a general election to focus on, I'm not going to get distracted by this anymore.
The primaries are over!
Focus on McCain
by really not a troll on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:49:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The main problem with your phrase (2.00 / 6)

"Hillary Clinton most likely would have won on a level playing field"

You know, "level", like when she's the only candidate on the ballot.


by BlueinColorado on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:49:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The main problem with your phrase (2.00 / 3)

Obviously.

After all, we all know that this primary was really a referendum on Hillary Clinton; people voted for Obama because of irrational, misogynistic hate for her.  Nobody in their right mind could seriously think Obama is a better candidate.  Therefore, the only fair ballot is one that truly reflects the referendum nature of this primary, and has only Hillary Clinton or "not Hillary Clinton" (let's call that "uncommitted").

In addition, campaigning only favors candidates with more charisma, better organization, a stronger strategy, and executive skills - things that are obviously less important for the presidency than experience.

Thus, the only truly level playing field in the whole primary race was Michigan - which Hillary Clinton took at 55%.  Therefore, by the only state in which the playing field truly reflected the nature of this campaign, Hillary Clinton should clearly have been the nominee.


Join the Matthew 25 Network and help Democrats win the next generation of evangelicals.
by mistersite on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:06:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Deadender (2.00 / 4)

Deadender is a term for people who are still scheming for ways to either:

a. have Hillary win the nomination

b. have Obama lose the election.

Supporting Hillary, voting for Hillary or even believing that Hillary might have been a better candidate in the long run, does not a "deadender" make.


accepting McLettuce is like being 9 years old and forced to eat your own cooking
by Sychotic1 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:24:02 PM EST

Not around here. The term's been bastardized. (2.00 / 1)

Josh, have you been reading the rec list? (1.66 / 3)

All the usual dead-enders now hate Olbermann as much or more than they hate(d) Obama.  They can't let go of it.

I don't give a shit whom you vote for.
by Dumbo on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 04:38:45 AM EST

I want a REAL journalist running the news! (1.87 / 8)

Like Katy Couric? Wolf Blitzer? Charley Gibson and George Steph? Britt Hume, Chris Matthews. lol.

But in the end, you just have to face up to the fact that the only "journalists" who shilled for Hillary (and are therefor "good") worked for Murdock, Scaife, and Limbaugh.

Anybody's vote is worth having. But not everybody's vote is worth campaigning for.
by Freespeechzone


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:31:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

How this race unfolded? ROTFLMAO (1.40 / 10)

This race was in Clintons hands and yet she lost. You cannot blame it all on Obama LOL.
Who support:

Rampant screwing around by spouse

Lying about so many things during an election that it will fill books for years to come.

Playing the race card with utter abandon until you wake up one morning and realise that your own stupidty has cost you 25% of the vote.

Making public your private thoughts about your opponent being shot before you again realize that most are not soul less, like yourself, and find you smell pretty bad now.

Still having to deal with that damn war that your pride won't allow you to apologize for.

Still having to deal with those dead people from Bosnia that someday you might have to answer for....along with your perverted husband.

Being so stupid that you gorget that their were camera's when you landed in Bosnia and even when it pernetrated your thick skull you continued to lie.

FL and MI. and not understanding that by lying and reneging you would piss off the MSM to the point that they would finally step up and support the other guy.


by Grissom1001 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:25:15 PM EST

Thanks for the opportunity to use a hide-rate. (2.00 / 1)

Please let me know if you don't understand why I gave it to you.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:32:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thanks for the opportunity to use a hide-rate. (2.00 / 2)

Because you didn't read the rating policy which says to only hide personal attacks on other users?


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:45:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I believe it includes attacking Dem candidates. nt (2.00 / 0)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:47:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I believe it includes attacking Dem candidates (2.00 / 3)

Candidates are fair game unless there is use of inflammatory language, and it would be pretty gallingly hypocritical of you to consider that comment inflammatory considering the diary you posted.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:56:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'm looking at these rules: (2.00 / 1)

* Users who are bashing or attacking any other user on the site, including authors of diaries and frontpage postings, will be banned. Candidates and politicians are fair game (but that doesn't mean you can use inflammatory language against candidates).

* Users who are excessively bashing the Democratic Party, or being Republican trolls, will be banned.

Let's see:

Rampant screwing around by spouse

Lying about so many things during an election that it will fill books for years to come.

Playing the race card with utter abandon until you wake up one morning and realise that your own stupidty has cost you 25% of the vote.

Making public your private thoughts about your opponent being shot before you again realize that most are not soul less, like yourself, and find you smell pretty bad now.

Still having to deal with that damn war that your pride won't allow you to apologize for.

Still having to deal with those dead people from Bosnia that someday you might have to answer for....along with your perverted husband.

Being so stupid that you gorget that their were camera's when you landed in Bosnia and even when it pernetrated your thick skull you continued to lie.

FL and MI. and not understanding that by lying and reneging you would piss off the MSM to the point that they would finally step up and support the other guy.

Why isn't that Republican troll banned yet?


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:51:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'm looking at these rules: (2.00 / 2)

No more inflammatory than your own diary, you are a hypocrite of the highest order.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 02:24:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

OK, smart guy. Money/mouth. Quote me. (2.00 / 0)

Quote me in this diary (or elsewhere) attacking Obama and his wife the way grissom attacked Hillary and Bill.

Back up your bullshit, or retract with an apology.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 03:56:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: OK, smart guy. Money/mouth. Quote me. (2.00 / 3)

Gee, I dunno, comparing the whole democratic party to the corrupt totalitarian societies of Orwell seems like A BILLION FUCKING TIMES WORSE.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:09:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: OK, smart guy. Money/mouth. Quote me. (2.00 / 2)

Is this snark, thanks for correcting the hide rating abuse here, I've repeated comments that were hidden though, so don't bother rating them all up or it just looks like I'm spamming.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 10:00:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: OK, smart guy. Money/mouth. Quote me. (2.00 / 2)

You assert that the entire Democratic party is comparable to an Orwellian totalitarian regime.  That is a technical godwin, and way worse than attacking one or two democrats.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:19:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: OK, smart guy. Money/mouth. Quote me. (2.00 / 2)

You did so in your diary above, where you compare Democrats to totalitarian Orwellian regimes.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:44:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And FYI: It appears you're sticking up for a troll (1.00 / 1)

http://grissom1001.mydd.com/

Draw your own conclusions.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 01:53:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And FYI: It appears you're sticking up for a t (2.00 / 2)

I'm arguing with a troll too, it's the circle of life.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 02:24:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'm not a troll, but grissom1001 is. Admit it, (1.00 / 1)

don't you feel a bit silly sticking up for a Republican troll who used such disgusting attacks against OUR (the Democratic Party's) Clintons?


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 03:54:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Libertyleft: Why did you TR this comment? nt (2.00 / 0)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:06:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Libertyleft: Why did you TR this comment? nt (2.00 / 1)

For the same reason you troll rated my comment above it.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:09:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Libertyleft: Why did you TR this comment? nt (2.00 / 1)

Personal attack, calling another user a troll.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:16:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Libertyleft: Why did you TR this comment? nt (1.00 / 0)

Personal attack, calling another user a troll.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:49:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Retaliatory TR, huh? You called me a troll, so my (2.00 / 0)

TR was warranted for a personal attack against a member - namely me.  My comment, not so much of a personal insult against you.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:19:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Retaliatory TR, huh? You called me a troll, s (2.00 / 1)

You called a member here a troll.  It's the same comment and worthy of the same rating.  


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 07:05:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No, b/c he's a troll, and I'm not, regardless of (1.00 / 1)

whether you appreciated my diary.  I am not here to troll.  He is.  


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 08:11:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Again (2.00 / 1)

Troll rated for personal attack of calling another user a troll.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 08:45:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You can continue breaking the rules w/o me. Bye. (none / 0)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:41:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No, b/c he's a troll, and I'm not, regardless (1.00 / 0)

Comparing democrats to Orwellian totalitarian regimes is not trolling?


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:54:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

A troll is someone who comes under false pretenses (none / 0)

, not someone who really is a Democrat and really is voting for Obama, but pens a diary bashing some Obama supporters for calling us non-Democrats just because we don't worship at the altar of Keith Olbermann, just because we believe that Obama's victory came with the media's assistance.

That is not a troll.  A troll is, for example, a Republican pretending to be a Democrat and posting a diary under false pretenses.

But I'm sure you know this and you're just being childish.  You're unable to admit you were wrong for sticking up for a troll, and unable to admit you are violating the rules of this site by TRing me.

Whatever, I won't report you.  I'm just leaving.  Bye.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:45:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

dur (none / 0)

You posted a diary comparing democrats to orwellian totalitarian regimes.  You don't get to pretend to have a moral high ground.


by libertyleft on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 01:37:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Retaliatory TR, huh? You called me a troll, s (2.00 / 1)

You called another member a troll, it's the exact same comment worthy of the exact same rating.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:27:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Retaliatory TR, huh? You called me a troll, s (1.00 / 0)

Personal attack, calling another member a troll.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:50:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Libertyleft: What was TR'able about this comment? (2.00 / 0)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:07:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Libertyleft: What was TR'able about this comm (2.00 / 1)

http://www.mydd.com/comments/2008/6/16/1 229/44867/84?mode=alone;showrate=1#84


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:10:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I like this one from grissom, the self described: (1.00 / 1)

"Married, white female":

http://www.mydd.com/comments/2008/6/13/1 72356/930/10#10

Let's see.  A new user to MyDD who acts like a man but describes him/herself, of all things on this planet, as merely a "Married, white female".  Not a Democrat, or an iron worker, or a progressive, or a Michigander, or a cat lover.  Just a "married, white female".  

Then, right after opening a new account, this "Married, white female" hurls constant insults at those who used to support Hillary, but are now voting for Obama, under the guise of being an Obama supporter that is just sick and tired of those Hillary "deadenders".

I'm calling my shot:  Grissom is a male Republican troll who joined MyDD under the guise of a female after Hillary conceded, in order to push Hillary supporters away from Obama and toward McCain.  

He feels that if he pretends to be an Obama supporter, and is obnoxious towards Hillary supporters, they'll vote McCain.

Thoughts?


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:17:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I like this one from grissom, the self describ (2.00 / 1)

Troll rated for personal attack. (calling another user a troll). Name calling, denigrating a site user.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 08:50:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You're being an obnoxious and childish prick. (1.00 / 1)

But I'm sure you know that, troll supporter.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 07:47:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Also (1.00 / 0)

Also for sexist comment, "acts like a man"


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:04:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Also (2.00 / 1)

My comment mysteriously vanished, troll rated for personal attack, calling another user a troll.


by libertyleft on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:22:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Considering you acknowledge you know the rules, (none / 0)

you've also acknowledged that you know you have broken them various times in this thread as it relates to my comments.

You don't like my diary, don't rec it, or even tr the tip jar.  But you've gone through and TRd comments in this thread that are not TRable and have absolutely nothing to do with you, and you know it.  Since I'm not one for telling Dad, I guess I'll just lower myself to your level and chase you around and TR everything you do around here.  Sound good?


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 08:14:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

There. Done. I feel better now. nt (none / 0)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 10:52:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Considering you acknowledge you know the rules (1.00 / 0)

I have only TR'd comments that are attacks on other users.  You, however, have spam rated and admins have been contacted.


by libertyleft on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 03:09:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Good, point them to this one, too. Once they see (none / 0)

the Republican troll comments that you stuck up for, and your unwarranted TRs on me, I'm sure they'll ignore your request and move on, just like I'm doing right now.  Bye!


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 05:12:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Good, point them to this one, too. Once they (1.00 / 0)

They already cleaned up the 0's that were spammed on me, so don't hold your breath.  You not liking the content of a post does not give you free reign to launch personal attacks.  


by libertyleft on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 05:18:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

But you not liking me exposing a Repub troll does? (none / 0)

As I stated, I am not the type to complain to Mom and Dad over a harmless TR here or there, like you have now proven yourself to be.  

Nonetheless, I am also not concerned with what Mom and Dad would think of my conduct in this thread, as it relates to your conduct in this thread.  

So, as they say, bring it on.  


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:16:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: But you not liking me exposing a Repub troll d (none / 0)

No, you didn't do the responsible thing and take up your opinion on a user with the admins, you called out another user with a personal attack and threw a tantrum and spammed comments with a 1 after the admins had already cleaned out ratings abuse on those same comments.  You think they are going to change their minds the second time around?

You are wrong, you launched a personal attack on a user in a diary that launched an attack on millions of democrats, you followed it up with spam ratings abuse.  This is all in violation of the site rules, and in no case have I applied inappropriate ratings.

Take a hint on the fact that the admins already looked at my comments and judged them okay, stop digging your hole deeper.  


by libertyleft on Tue Jun 17, 2008 at 06:23:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Congratulations, loser, I got a warning. (1.00 / 1)

Its ok.  Don't worry.  I stopped crying my fucking eyes out from the shame of being warned on an internet message board, and I think I'll be able to carry on in life, regardless of this scarlet letter I must now carry for eternity.

Don't worry.  I won't troll-rate you anymore, loser.  You can stop crying now.  


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 10:50:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Congratulations, loser, I got a warning. (none / 0)

Funny, they didn't warn me about anything.  You would think that would mean something in an argument about site rules about how to use ratings.  QQ.


by libertyleft on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 01:17:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Funny you're such a loser. Keep up the good work. (1.00 / 1)


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Wed Jun 18, 2008 at 05:35:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Ham it up, drama (queen/king). (2.00 / 4)

As I have read Animal Farm, I know what that means.  Soon, the pigs will send the dogs to tear my throat out, while the sheep keep bleating "four legs good, two legs better", in the background.

When that happens, please don't let me get in the way of your glorious death scene - because I'm sure you'll be chewing the scenery like there's no tomorrow.  Very dramatic.

Please get over yourself.  This diary is utterly ridiculous.


Join the Matthew 25 Network and help Democrats win the next generation of evangelicals.
by mistersite on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:30:28 PM EST

Thanks, but I can't take all the credit. (2.00 / 0)

I'd like to thank all the Obama supporters who claim that those who don't like Keith Olbermann are not real Democrats...

and the Academy, of course.  I can't forget to thank the Academy.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:36:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: (2.00 / 6)

Why is there so much melodrama on MyDD today?  


by rfahey22 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:32:09 PM EST

Re: (2.00 / 3)

No body has time to watch the Daytime Soaps.


Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
by jsfox on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:46:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hillary is gone, (2.00 / 4)

but her legacy of divisive bitterness lingers.


Anybody's vote is worth having. But not everybody's vote is worth campaigning for.
by Freespeechzone on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 12:48:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Are you a troll, new user? (none / 0)

You've got no diaries and about 30 comments in your one day here, and upthread you used one of your comments to stick up for a republican troll with no diaries and like 11 comments in his one day here.

Just sayin......


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 02:06:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That's a good one coming from you. (2.00 / 2)

I've been here for a long time. I fully support the Democratic nominee Obama and oppose those who try to injure him and the cause of progress.

If that makes me a troll on this site, then so be it.


Anybody's vote is worth having. But not everybody's vote is worth campaigning for.
by Freespeechzone on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 02:26:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I take it back. I thought you had a total of 30 (none / 0)

comments, but it only shows the 30 most recent.

Apology and retraction for the troll comment.


My name is Barney Gumble, and I'm an alcoholic. Lisa: This is a girl scouts meeting. Barney: Is it, or is it you girls can't admit that you have a problem?
by PJ Jefferson on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 03:47:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That's very big of you. (2.00 / 1)

Thanks.


Anybody's vote is worth having. But not everybody's vote is worth campaigning for.
by Freespeechzone on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 04:44:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Apologize? Why should he... (2.00 / 1)

Unfortunately, the truth can be very painful sometimes.


"Beauty, more than bitterness, makes the heart break." Sara Teasdale
by april34fff on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:11:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Apologize? Why should he... (2.00 / 1)

this is in reference to Grissom's very accurate comment upthread.


"Beauty, more than bitterness, makes the heart break." Sara Teasdale
by april34fff on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 05:15:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary is gone, (1.00 / 3)

yes you are a troll for bashing other dems and your attempts to keep the party divided. and it is not new behavior for you.


by zerosumgame on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 09:01:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary is gone, (